Siduction Forum
Siduction Forum => Ideas & Improvements => Topic started by: tuxracer on 2012/09/09, 20:04:44
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If this forum / distribution is really trying to be different than the 'sidux / aptosid' atmosphere and don't mind some constructive and personal opinions, then please read. :)
I just thought my complaints were valid and I'll try to explain:
1) I have some trouble logging on here. I have to repeatedly input my password multiple times before it logs me on. I am thinking, 'what, am I inputting the wrong password or what?!? What's going on?!?' But, then it works. I have no idea why.
2) I was going to install this OS but I am having second thoughts. I'm SORRY, SORRY, SORRY.... but, I don't like the installer at all.
It's confusing and for me, awful to look at. I am sure someone will be insulted but it's my perspective. At least, I'm being honest, right? I'll try to explain.
I like installers that can easily display and detect my hardware. I like the GUIs for Parted whether it's GParted and kdeparted because I guess I'm a visual person. I like some visual representation besides just textual content.
But, for me, the installer is a mess. I printed out notes of my configuration and nothing the installer shows matches. I think you could guess how that might be disconcerting? 'Please be careful.' Ja, I sure will. :-(
Unless something with the installer (for me) just clicks, I'll probably have to install Debian again. The installer is ugly and basic but I have less trouble with it.
Thanks for reading. Everything else sounds really good with the OS and I understand the more 'hands-on' nature (i.e. more manual configuration) but I'm paranoid when installing. Too much can go wrong. Just read all the posts in any distro forum (under 'Installation).
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If this forum / distribution is really trying to be different than the 'sidux / aptosid' atmosphere and don't mind some constructive and personal opinions, then please read. :)
I just thought my complaints were valid and I'll try to explain:
Hi tuxracer -- welcome! And yes, suggestions and opinions are welcome here.
1) I have some trouble logging on here. I have to repeatedly input my password multiple times before it logs me on. I am thinking, 'what, am I inputting the wrong password or what?!? What's going on?!?' But, then it works. I have no idea why.
Me neither. Here's a tip -- when you look at the forum front page, you can see two places to log in. At the top of the white space, underneath the blue menu across the top is one -- I think that's what you are using. But look up in the very top right-hand corner of the gray -- above the German menu where it says "Sitemap". If you use that one, you might find a better result.
BACKGROUND -- this forum was quickly set up before siduction launched last year. A new, better forum is currently under construction, so no big efforts will go into re-engineering the current forum.
2) I was going to install this OS but I am having second thoughts. I'm SORRY, SORRY, SORRY.... but, I don't like the installer at all.
It's confusing and for me, awful to look at. I am sure someone will be insulted but it's my perspective. At least, I'm being honest, right? I'll try to explain.
I like installers that can easily display and detect my hardware. I like the GUIs for Parted whether it's GParted and kdeparted because I guess I'm a visual person. I like some visual representation besides just textual content.
But, for me, the installer is a mess. I printed out notes of my configuration and nothing the installer shows matches. I think you could guess how that might be disconcerting? 'Please be careful.' Ja, I sure will. :-(
You only install once -- I would not choose an OS based only on the installer. I take your point, and it is your opinion, which is fair. I have long been in the habit of using a Parted Magic bootable USB stick to partition my hdd or SSD before I ever boot the Linux Live CD/USB stick -- I like to do the installation on a fully-partitioned drive, so I don't have to think about partitioning while I'm trying to install the OS. I've installed siduction about a half-dozen times now, and I find no problem with the installer, so I guess we have here a matter of personal taste. :wink:
Unless something with the installer (for me) just clicks, I'll probably have to install Debian again. The installer is ugly and basic but I have less trouble with it.
Thanks for reading. Everything else sounds really good with the OS and I understand the more 'hands-on' nature (i.e. more manual configuration) but I'm paranoid when installing. Too much can go wrong. Just read all the posts in any distro forum (under 'Installation).
My wife uses Debian 6, and all I can say is, you better love the old versions of your software! :lol:
Seriously, I recommend you take a Parted Magic or some other Live CD that has Parted on it, and do your partitioning first, and be done with it. Then boot your siduction Live OS and just install it, by selecting the existing partition(s). It takes about 2.5 minutes -- really. :)
And thanks for taking the time to give your opinion!
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Hey dibl,
I tried the site map path and I was logged in on the first try! Thanks!
I apologize for the poor explanation regarding the installer. I re=read it and it's poorly expressed. Also, it was my fault. I noticed that the device designation was different than what I expected, that's all. Also, I had to focus on what the options were.
I still am not particularly fond of it but I'm just nitpicking now.
I use Parted Magic. too.
I guess my suggestions aren't that great. The first part sounds like it's a matter of time until I have no issue logging in and the second part, sounds like 'thanks for the comments' but we're satisfied with it, which is fine. :-)
Anyway, I'll try to install. Thanks for the reply. :)
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ALso from me a warm welcome. :-)
I guess your problem is solved, if not, feel free to ask!
As dibl already said, the installer is only used once. And I think it is not that bad. It deos its job - install siduction in usual less than 8min (depending your hardware)
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I'm giving up, though. Three attempts and all failures.
Also, why does one have to run through hoops on the live media to use applications like gparted?!? The siduction-installer is needed or you have to look up in the manual about being root?
Some ubuntu program is running as well?
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Hi tuxracer,
after finishing the installer gives you a list of messages.
May you provide it?
You may run gparted with a mouse click from within the installer. This works with the kde-flavour at least, I did this a few times.
Or you may use xhost +
sux
gparted
"xhost +" is needed with live-Cd as far as I know.
Don't know what you mean with:
Some ubuntu program is running as well?
greets ayla
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to start gparted in the live media
$ su-to-root -X -c gparted
sux is still broken
bequimao@siductionbox:~$ sux
Senha:
bash: cannot set terminal process group (-1): ioctl inapropriado para dispositivo
bash: nenhum controle de trabalho nesta `shell'
Best regards,
Bequimão
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Just a few points: We are working on some kind of cli-installer. Maybe this installer can catch up some fans. We also work on slightly improvements for the installer. But if this is happend within the next release - i don't really know. We are on it and here is the ETA for it: It's done, when it's done.
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For some reason, I'm having a lot of computer problems recently.
I'm giving the benefit of the doubt and saying, something was wrong with my computer.
I just thought my grub was gone from the previous OS being messed up. My Debian install was corrupt and I gave up trying to diagnose and troubleshoot so I decided to re-install (an OS).
Anyway, to make a long story short, the computer was booting up with the final message, CD-ROM Boot Priority...No Medium....Reboot and Select proper Boot device..... or Insert Boot Media in selected Boot device and press a key.
We've seen this before at various times, right? Well, I didn't change anything in my boot options (i.e. BIOS) and I went with the livecd but the drives were detected. I googled this 'message' and ultimately went into the BIOS. I didn't think anything was out of the ordinary but I must have made one change or something (or maybe just luck) and I was able to boot again.
The last OS I tried to install was Mepis 12 (beta) because I had a cd lying around. So, I am hoping the problem was something I missed and it should work now.
Sorry about my rants. The installer isn't bad. I just prefer the 'dummy friendly' ones with extensive GUI stuff that Mint/Ubuntu/Mepis uses.
I don't mind the Debian text installer, though. I've been through that one many times.
The Ubuntu reference is based on some msg that shows up if/when trying to log in as root after starting GParted (separate from the siduction-installer). If the authentication fails, there's a blurb on the left-hand side showing ***Ubuntu**. I have no idea what it is.
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I just discovered the Mepis I installed is an 'alpha' spin. 11.9.x (something). So, there will be bugs as it's not a final yet.
So, I'll do another install.
Siduction should work this time. :)
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Just a few points: We are working on some kind of cli-installer. Maybe this installer can catch up some fans. We also work on slightly improvements for the installer. But if this is happend within the next release - i don't really know. We are on it and here is the ETA for it: It's done, when it's done.
cli-installer +100 :)
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Authentication is required to run the GParted Partition Editor
ETC ETC
Password for root:
Authentication Failure
Details
Action: com.ubuntu.pkexec.gparted
Vendor:
.COM.*****UBUNTU******.PKEXEC.GPARTED
EDIT: What is happening there??!?
Ok, I used option #2 in the manual to set a root password. Step #1 doesn't work.
Anyway, imho, I think it sucks I have to do that (i.e. look up what to do in the manual!) but oh well. I'm not sure why you can't just type 'root' or hit enter but I guess you want security even in live cd mode?
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Sorry, guys, I tried. It's not like I haven't installed a distro before. Installed Debian and debian derivatives many times. I already didn't like the installer.
Installation Finished
Sorry, the installation of siduction has failed. Please remove the error and start again.
Runtime of the installation: 04:35
Do you have problems? Surf to the IRC channel or to the forum.
Log
O: loading modules
O: Initialisation done
O: starting installation
O: starting load_config
O: load the configuration
O: starting prepareHD
O: prepare disk for the installation
O: Mounting
O: Mounting
O: Mounting
E: Mounting of /dev/sdc3:/home failed. Some messages from mount: mount: can't find /fll/hdinstall/home in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab
O: siduction-installer ended abnormally
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my guess is, your nickname is 'siddi' on the forum (it is a good idea to use the same nickname in the support facilities of a distro).
That said, if you like, we walk you through the installer in the IRC. Hardly anyone has probs with the installer. you seem to have a prob with /home. But without further info there is nothing to be done.
greetz
devil
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Hi,
Gparted problem is already fixed if you do a dist-upgrade after you install siduction.
If you want to run gparted from livcd install desktop-defalts-common and desktop-defaults-* where * is your's siduction flavour.
Good luck!
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No, I was just insulted.
The community reminds me of sidux (i.e. the sidux days).
Sid is supposed to require more manual evaluation as way more can go wrong, I'm sure. Packages mismatch and so on.
I have done the same kind of procedures in Debian and Mepis but usually, it has worked out. I just thought siduction might have some of this configured and since most of the documentation is regarding running a Debian sid system, it sounded promising.
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so to come into #siduction, saying:
<siddy> this distro sucks...crappy support and crappy documentation is what you call being insulted?
You are right, you are insulting us, our distro and users. So please go elsewhere. kthxxbye.
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so to come into #siduction, saying:
<siddy> this distro sucks...crappy support and crappy documentation is what you call being insulted?
You are right, you are insulting us, our distro and users. So please go elsewhere. kthxxbye.
Couldn't have said it better myself !
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Yes, I was out of line. I apologize. Also, when I had the initial problem, I should have provided more information to help your 'side' troubleshoot. I understand the procedure is to provide console output via pastebin or similar hosting site?
Also, yes, my familiarity is with Debian Stable and Testing (now Wheezy) so some variances to what I'm used to might occur.
But, your admin, devil, is a dishonest and deceptive person and he's the Admin. I'm not sure his position there but I think it is in poor taste to insult users so quickly. He didn't include his comments.
I thought the devs and administrators of this distro was claiming to be more user-friendly and open to the community compared to previous ventures and projects. That is, compared to previous reputation. Personally, I don't see it, others might perceive differently.
I just wanted to apologize for my outburst as I was frustrated and then alarmed at the reaction on the irc.
It was my fault but I still object to the reaction primarily from devil.
I'll go elsewhere as requested. I'll give debian a whirl. Lots of ppl there but maybe they won't jump the gun so quickly. Maybe will give me some more time before insulting. :)
Tscheuss.
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for the record:
today's outburst was not the first one, and to give the complete picture:
[14:37:54] <siddy> this distro sucks...crappy support and crappy documentation
[14:46:37] <towo> siddy, use another
[14:53:36] <devil> siddy: get lost.
[14:54:47] <devil> being as clueless as you are, you would not be able to tell crap from gold
[14:55:06] <siddy> this community is so cool!
[14:55:06] <devil> windows to the rescue.
[14:55:44] <siddy> I don't see why not everyone is rushing over here
5 minutes later on #debian:
[15:00:32] <devil> siddy: if you can't work with siduction, you will fail to run sid also
[15:01:21] <siddy> devil, piss off... and take your sh*t distro with you
kthxxbye
greetz
devil
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I apologized. Yes, you said 'get lost' and something about a 3 year old being able to do ....blah, blah.
I just reacted because I was surprised an admin would act so...
Anyway, it's nothing against this distro. I was blowing off steam from having some difficulties installing some software.
I didn't 'lose it' until I had an admin insulting me while I was having a hard time with an install.
I apologize if any of the community and devs took offense. piper et al, sorry about that. But, I'm not sure why you support an admin that insults users.
I will try to have patience from now on (with Debian sid). I will need to. devil is right in thinking sid will be no easier but hopefully, I won't be belittled when I run into problems. Bye.
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Strange people...
good luck at $any distro
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piper et al, sorry about that. But, I'm not sure why you support an admin that insults users.
To be honest, I live in Cheektowaga,NY and don't see no insult period.
Now, if you want to be insulted, you should hear what my toilet says after you flush it.
I have known devil for a number of years, insulting, no, telling it how it is, yes.
He's not just an admin here but also a developer along with other fine people of this community. I have the utmost respect for devil (and the rest of the team, community)
What I learned in the 90's using linux you can't be soft-skinned, it is like life in general, it has its bumps, grinds and rewards, carry on, party dude.
Maybe this distro's not for you.
Have you tried ubuntu? I heard it does everything for you and is like M$ where all you do is point and click.
sid can be frustrating if your new to it and has a learning curve and one MUST be willing to learn
I hope I didn't insult you, but I really don't think siduction is for you.
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Thankfully, only for a short time, I once had a job which entailed helping people. I taught me a lot. You had to be a "saint" (English expression). People get frustrated and angry when they can't understand how to get what they want from their purchase (even though it was supposed to be "idiot proof"!). At moments like these it's easy for them to curse the item, the people who made it and of course the poor guy who is trying to help them.
But I couldn't reciprocate (a) because of store policy, (b) the store didn't want dissatisfied customers (refunds) and (c) loss of store reputation. For me it was just a case of keeping my cool and plugging away until the user suddenly caught on to the solution. At that point most customer's mood changed instantly to one of delight and thanks once they saw how "easy" it was. I've no doubt that when this happened it led to increased store sales simply because of the rush the customer got when the solution clicked in his mind and his desire to talk about it with his friends.
I suspect it's easier when you're getting paid to help someone. I don't think I could have handled it voluntarily.
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To be honest, I live in Cheektowaga,NY and don't see no insult period.
Now, if you want to be insulted, you should hear what my toilet says after you flush it.
I have known devil for a number of years, insulting, no, telling it how it is, yes.
He's not just an admin here but also a developer along with other fine people of this community. I have the utmost respect for devil (and the rest of the team, community)
What I learned in the 90's using linux you can't be soft-skinned, it is like life in general, it has its bumps, grinds and rewards, carry on, party dude.
Maybe this distro's not for you.
Have you tried ubuntu? I heard it does everything for you and is like M$ where all you do is point and click.
sid can be frustrating if your new to it and has a learning curve and one MUST be willing to learn
I hope I didn't insult you, but I really don't think siduction is for you.
Nope, not at all.
I can tell you that I said in the channel, it's my fault and I need to change my approach.
I am still using siduction and recently upgraded the kernel. :)
I'm trying to wear a thicker skin and ride the bumps. :)
I also hope to help by using the bug filing method (i.e. siduction-bug-report).