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2019/04/19, 02:52:57


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Author [EN] [PL] [ES] [PT] [IT] [DE] [FR] [NL] [TR] [SR] [AR] [RU] Topic: warning! today upgrade will remove without asking your nvidia 390xx driver!!  (Read 790 times)

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Offline df8oe

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I am feeling like a Windows user.... I started upgrade and without any warning my 390xx driver was removed because "my graphics card is no longer supported". Fast manual reinstalling will revert this - but this is a no-go for a free system... And my decision to leave nvidia forever is manifested...

Offline piper

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You could have at least told us what video card you have
"We're all grown up and don't freak out when a piece of text contains the word 'fuck'. I still don't understand why people think that the word 'fuck' is what would keep certain groups from contributing to the Linux kernel. In all seriousness, it doesn't."

John Paul Adrian Glaubitz

Offline towo

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Apt allways print packages to remove!
Apt never warn about anything!

o your post is like bad propaganda.
Ich gehe nicht zum Karneval, ich verleihe nur manchmal mein Gesicht.

Offline piper

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Another side note

Should always use (for people that are click "y" happy)


Code: [Select]
apt update; apt full-upgrade -dy
That way you can see what apt wants to do, then YOU can decide what You want apt to do
"We're all grown up and don't freak out when a piece of text contains the word 'fuck'. I still don't understand why people think that the word 'fuck' is what would keep certain groups from contributing to the Linux kernel. In all seriousness, it doesn't."

John Paul Adrian Glaubitz

Offline df8oe

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It is like "stealth"  ;) .


Upgrade of package  "nvidia-legacy-check" asks you if you want to activate new driver (which does not support my quadro4000). So I answered with "no" - but inspite of this complete nvidia 396xx drivers are installed...


Only way to get rid of this was to purge "nvidia-legacy-check" and reinstall "nvidia-legacy-390xx-driver"...


Of course this is not problem of Siduction - it is problem of non-free nvidia drivers. My warning is that simple answering "no" does NOT prevent from installing complete incompatible 396xx stuff...


EDIT:
This happens at "apt upgrade" - NO DU!

Offline piper

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As said on the nvidia site

Quote
The Linux 390.* legacy driver series is the last to support GF1xx ("Fermi") GPUs.  Support for new Linux kernels and X servers, as well as fixes for critical bugs, will be included in 390.* legacy releases through the end of 2022.

Debian still, as far as I know supports

Quadro 4000 [GF100GL], Quadro 4000M [GF104GLM]

nvidia-legacy-390xx-driver


What is a Legacy GPU?





"We're all grown up and don't freak out when a piece of text contains the word 'fuck'. I still don't understand why people think that the word 'fuck' is what would keep certain groups from contributing to the Linux kernel. In all seriousness, it doesn't."

John Paul Adrian Glaubitz

Offline df8oe

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Hi Piper,


yes - so it is. What have made me crazy is that I made
- apt update
- apt upgrade
... when process reaches "nvidia-legacy-check" I was told that recent driver does not support my graphics-card (dialog style) and I have two possibilities: 1) activate recent driver anyway or 2) do not activate. So I selected of course "no" and thought that's it - but I was wrong. At reboot I was dropped to terminal login and investigated that many parts of the legacy-driver now have version 396xx instead of 390xx and so I do no longer have X. But at the list apt showed me before I confirmed there was only "nvidia-legacy-check" to upgrade - no other nvidia package! It seems so that "nvidia-legacy-check" has done the decision for me. First I reinstalled 390xx driver but at next apt upgrade it was gone again same way. I must purge "nvidia-legacy-check" first, then reinstall 390xx driver and now u and d-u runs smoothly. I do not have any other machine with exactly this configuration so I cannot test if it is reproduceable.

Offline piper

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Quote
- apt update
- apt upgrade

This should never be done in debian sid !

This is probably why you had problems to begin with
"We're all grown up and don't freak out when a piece of text contains the word 'fuck'. I still don't understand why people think that the word 'fuck' is what would keep certain groups from contributing to the Linux kernel. In all seriousness, it doesn't."

John Paul Adrian Glaubitz

Offline df8oe

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Please help me. I am walking since 4 years through this path:


first apt update
then apt upgrade
then apt full-upgrade


...and NEVER ran into problems. Additionally I cannot understand why this should happen.


First is fetching new packages list
second is "without removing / installing new" packages
third is with both


???

Offline piper

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Code: [Select]
apt update; apt full-upgrade
Is all you need

I never understand why people insist on using "apt upgrade" in a sid environment ???
"We're all grown up and don't freak out when a piece of text contains the word 'fuck'. I still don't understand why people think that the word 'fuck' is what would keep certain groups from contributing to the Linux kernel. In all seriousness, it doesn't."

John Paul Adrian Glaubitz

Offline df8oe

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The reason is that when something is uncomfortable (e.g. at a qt transition) many hundreds of packages can already be upgraded and a few persists which cannot be upgraded yet. You can see if something is continuously broken without gathering tons of packages and get every day more. apt upgrade solves most.


What is the reason that I can run into trouble if I first upgrade the packages which do not remove or add new packages?

Offline piper

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There is already a discussion on this, please search the forums
"We're all grown up and don't freak out when a piece of text contains the word 'fuck'. I still don't understand why people think that the word 'fuck' is what would keep certain groups from contributing to the Linux kernel. In all seriousness, it doesn't."

John Paul Adrian Glaubitz

Offline df8oe

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I have done so and found some posts where people tell one should never ever use "upgrade" - but without explanation why simple "upgrade" should harm anything. In one post is mentioned "...as it is in the docs..." but without link and hint which docs.


Hmm.


I have worked using two steps since the beginning of my "Siduction-days" and never ran into probelms because of this. Many times my system was nearer at a complete upgraded system as if I would have use "dist-upgrade" because hundreds of packages were already installed and worked flawlessly.


The reason of my post was a package from nvidia which replaced partially 390xx drivers without possibility to stop that - you have to purge the package first so that old drivers leave untouched.


Nevertheless this is definitely my last nvidia card and I will share my experiences about "software planned obsolescence" with others... The ressources of our planet do not allow to set a driver-based end to thousands (may be millions) of graphic cards which run perfectly for their users. It is the decision of the users - not of the manufacturer. And giving software-support for these cards cannot be a question of costs. I think it is more a question "how to sell new cards".


EDIT:
I have searched the web and found in the official debian WIKI https://wiki.debian.org/DebianUnstable:


##################################

Bearing this in mind, apt-get dist-upgrade to keep your system fully up-to-date, but if the proposed changes do look unreasonable, some of the simpler things that could help are:


  • put packages on hold until the problem in the archive is resolved,
  • use apt-get upgrade to avoid removals this time,
  • simply wait until the archive has settled down to a more reasonable state before upgrading.
##################################


 ::) ...
« Last Edit: 2019/02/12, 08:39:24 by df8oe »

Offline tommy2

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df8oe, I try to follow the advise from those that make Siduction such a good distribution and use the full-upgrade. That is until I get in a situation where a lot of programs are to be removed, that's when I use upgrade. My reasons are two fold as I have found that especially when a new kernel is to be install I can do that and also reduce the total number of packages to be upgraded at the same time. To date that is the only time I use plain upgrade and have either had good luck that everything worked and in my case still works. I don't think you need to do both stages every time you update your system and like Piper stated it is not a good idea with sid. That said do what you think works best for your situation, but remember the moderators here do their best to keep all of us up and running with minimal side effects.  ;)
« Last Edit: 2019/02/14, 14:37:37 by tommy2 »

Offline dibl

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@df8oe, the problem is, "upgrade" does not know about new packages that have been introduced into sid by the development team. It only knows about the packages you already have.

So if you only use "upgrade", your version of Debian gradually drifts away from the full sid OS.  And, if the new packages are important to the function of the OS, your version will eventually fail to operate.
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