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Offline vilde

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Is this a German distro????
« on: 2012/01/03, 01:47:10 »
I'm really bored of this distros, kanotix, sidux and aptosid, who claims that they are community friendly and then have a forum which is divided into two languages and where the major one is German. I did a quick counting and found around 400 posts in English and 12000 in German. I know that all Germans are not good in English, I know that because I have been there quite a lot, but it's the same in a lot of other country’s. I don't say I like it, I don't say that I don't like it but but English is the main language in the world and in the computer world.
 
It's always easier to speak or write your own language and this way with a German forum there will be a very lot forum posts written in German even if the writer is good in English. This is like putting everybody except Germans on some isolated Ireland and then feed them with the things you like but not all. Yes, we can translate with some automatic web feature, but that’s not good enough.

And it doesn't matter if you have one German and one English forum or have them together, it's the same shit.

If you want siduction to be a German distro, ok, it's your distro but I really think it's a waste to let so much information not being enough understandable to the rest of the world, this will keep  a lot of not German speaking users away and you will also loose the big wonderful idea of a nice worldwide community driven distro.

Last I have to say that: I don't have anything against Germans or the German language, this is only my feelings of a language divided forum where I feel put aside because the main posts and discussion is in a minor language that I don't understand, and the fact that i really think this is mostly bad for the commynity.

Offline coruja

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RE: Is this a German distro????
« Reply #1 on: 2012/01/03, 02:45:15 »
Hi vilde! :)

The reason for the vast majority of posts in German is the fact that this forum still contains all the posts of the former aptosid.de forum (as we forked that forum/site too). But don't be afraid, we put much effort in siduction being international and we think that we should offer our users support and community chat in their mother language as far as we can provide. So far, these are German and English here, and not to forget Brazilian Portuguese at siduction.com.br (as a community project on their own). You're right, up to now, most of the developers are German, and the history of siduction (from kanotix to aptosid) was also mainly based in Germany. So please try to understand that we don't want to drive German users (especially those ones who don't speak English) away, but we also want to be attractive to international users like you. So we thought it would be best to offer both under one roof, a bilingual portal to siduction, in English and German. And please notice that we try hard to keep anything concerning development (e.g. bug tracker, core team meetings) in English so that most people can follow and participate if they want to.

Thank you for your honest criticism and feel invited to stay here. ;)

Offline ayla

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #2 on: 2012/01/03, 03:25:23 »
Hi vilde

May I link to a present discussion?

http://forum.siduction.org/index.php?topic=1674

As you may read I see it as an advantage to have both languages in one place.
And as I read another post of you, you showed one of this advantages there. I refer to this policy-kit post. You did find it in the german section and transferred the relevant part to the english section.
If evrything works as I imagin' it will get good practice that anyone who is trained in one language and is finding a solution he will translate it and let others, not so trained users, know.

As I have my diffulties in technical english especially too I would not like to miss the german part, because only there I can ask exaktly and understand the answers (hopefully) as well.

And I'm sure, as much posts in english came in in the last days, it will not take long and we will have a good balance.

greets
ayla.
« Last Edit: 2013/11/10, 02:19:40 by ayla »
Kernel: 4.18.11-towo.1-siduction-amd64 x86_64
Desktop: KDE Plasma 5.13.5
(mostly) kept current siduction "18.3.0 Patience"
HP EliteBook 8570p; MoBo: HP model: 17A7 v: KBC Version 42.35
Dual core  i5-3320M (-MT-MCP-)
Intel 3. Gen Graphics (Ivybridge) Driver:i915/ intel
 Wifi Intel Centrino N6205

Offline vilde

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #3 on: 2012/01/03, 11:26:10 »
Quote
As you may read I see it as an advantage to have both languages in one place.
And as I read another post of you, you showed one of this advantages there. I refer to this policy-kit post. You did find it in the german section and transferred the relevant part to the english section.
You got it a little wrong. I found it like this, (problem: usb-stick wasn't able to mount after fresh install of siduction XFCE). First I looked on your forum, tried to search for the problem and didn't find it, because I didn't search for the right words, because the answer was written in German I found a possible solution in aptosid English forum, tried it, and it worked. Then I searched sort of backwards, I searched your forum with the solution (policykit-1) then I found it. As you can see the information was useless for me because it was written in the wrong language and therefore not search-able for me.

It will always be a problem to search for the right words specially technical ones in a foreign language, just like you say ayla. The problem is that now the discussions and the written solutions will be divided in two foreign language for us non English and non German natives. Everything will not be written in both languages and then I believe that the community will loose on this and the community will be smaller than it would be with one language.

Offline michaa7

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #4 on: 2012/01/03, 12:01:38 »
Although I can understand your frustration to not find a solution to a problem, because the solution was written in German, you simply cannot expect that a distribution based in Germany with many german teammembers cuts its ties to german users who don't speak english or do not feel comfy doing so.

On the other hand, I am sure the number of not-german-speaking users will grow rapidly. And we will have the "problem", that german-only users wont find solutions in the english part of the forum.

Anyway, most of the moderators (if not all) understand and speak both languages and will react appropriately to whatever problem may arise in whichever part of the forum. And bilingual users usually follow both parts and will help out wherever they can! It has ever been this way!
Ok, you can't code, but you still might be able to write a bug report for Debian's sake

Offline michaaa62

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #5 on: 2012/01/03, 14:52:04 »
Warning: Strong opinion ahead!!!

Move on, if you do not like it here. It is as easy as this...
That may sound hard, but while aptosid.de and later aptosidusers.de were German-only forums, aptosid.com itself is English only, which suits you best!??? You even found the solution for your ( and others) problem there.

But you also could do a bold move and start you Swedish thread in this forum to spread the word of Linux and siduction. There were some native Threads during sidux.
You could even take a bigger step and start your Swedish forum and help to spread linux this way, like the enthusiastic otto did for aptosid and siduction in Brazil to communicate in their native language.

Please be not offended, at least not too much! ;)

Offline ayla

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #6 on: 2012/01/03, 16:00:19 »
nice idea.

I can remember a long italian thread with many different users and many different problems discussed there in sidux days.

Maybe a subsection "other languages" for a start?

greets ayla
Kernel: 4.18.11-towo.1-siduction-amd64 x86_64
Desktop: KDE Plasma 5.13.5
(mostly) kept current siduction "18.3.0 Patience"
HP EliteBook 8570p; MoBo: HP model: 17A7 v: KBC Version 42.35
Dual core  i5-3320M (-MT-MCP-)
Intel 3. Gen Graphics (Ivybridge) Driver:i915/ intel
 Wifi Intel Centrino N6205

Offline vilde

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #7 on: 2012/01/03, 17:18:51 »
Quote

But you also could do a bold move and start you Swedish thread in this forum to spread the word of Linux and siduction.
We don't need that, we understand English here in Sweden
 
Quote

Please be not offended, at least not too much!
I'm not offended :)

And as I wrote before, the community will be more and more divided with each new language, I think it's the wrong way to go.

Offline belze

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #8 on: 2012/01/03, 18:52:21 »
i didn't find useful a single (huge) post, language specific. It was impossible to follow a complete discussion (at least the italian one). Because every new user wants to say "hi, i have that problem" and than 3 pages after someone posts a solution.
I don't have a solution, i asked the same in another discussion. Anyway i doubt everyone in Sweden understand english  :mrgreen:

Offline mylo

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Re: Is this a German distro????
« Reply #9 on: 2012/01/03, 19:41:25 »
Quote from: "vilde"
... I know that all Germans are not good in English,..

Where have you been though in Germany?
Regards mylo
____________________________________________ ____
"Die gefährlichste aller Weltanschauungen ist die Weltanschauung der Leute,
welche die Welt nicht angeschaut haben."               Alexander von Humboldt

Offline mylo

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #10 on: 2012/01/03, 19:51:20 »
Quote from: "michaaa62"
Warning: Strong opinion ahead!!!....


Strong? May be! But fine!!
Regards mylo
____________________________________________ ____
"Die gefährlichste aller Weltanschauungen ist die Weltanschauung der Leute,
welche die Welt nicht angeschaut haben."               Alexander von Humboldt

Offline ralul

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Re: Is this a German distro????
« Reply #11 on: 2012/01/03, 19:57:50 »
Germany, as big and fat and rich as it is, does synchronize,translate all series and film from California and Sweden ... in such a quality that the transferred works are much superior than originals ("Die Zwei").

Other people in europe do have the advantage to learn original english language, where we hear some bad teacher english at school.
experiencing siduction runs better than my gentoo makes me know I know nothing

Offline oduffo

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Re: Is this a German distro????
« Reply #12 on: 2012/01/03, 21:03:29 »
Quote
where we hear some bad teacher english at school


yes, it shows.

Offline vilde

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Re: Is this a German distro????
« Reply #13 on: 2012/01/03, 21:20:51 »
Quote from: "mylo"
Quote from: "vilde"
... I know that all Germans are not good in English,..

Where have you been though in Germany?
Mostly in and around Bremen and my experience is that older people doesn't speak any English at all but the younger generation does, better and better. It's around the same in a lot of other countries. In Sweden before second world war the first foreign language in school was German, then after the war it turned to English so probably most people around 60 and younger have had English in school. I think that’s a little later in Germany, maybe I'm wrong. And yes, movies and TV with subtitle have helped us here in Sweden to understand English, but also the German way of synchronize all foreign movies and also in direct live television makes it harder to train your English in Germany, I agree.

It's not me saying that Germans are so bad in English that they can't manage a English forum it's you people who say you have to have a German forum to keep the German users. I think that most of the users of an Linux dist like this would manage to have an English only forum also in Germany, it's a matter of a little more work a little more interest and will.

By the way I have to say that for me it's a little fun and very weird to look on German TV or cinema hearing Clint Eastwood with the wrong voice speaking German, or The Godfather, Marlon Brando lost his wonderful voice to a German synchronized one ;)

holgerw

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Is this a German distro????
« Reply #14 on: 2012/01/03, 22:12:38 »
Hello @vilde,

welcome here to the forum of siduction.

Feel free to fill this english part of Forum with questions and comments in english language.

If I find an english thread and I can help, I'll try my best and I think, other people from siduction team or german users of siduction will do similar.

You've mentioned, that some german people are not very familar with english. And sorry, why should such people invest time in learning a new langugage only for managing a tool and speaking about it, when it is also possible in german language? Linux and other EDV stuff are for human beings, not vice versa, and good german translations of free software make it possible, that my old father also is able to use opensuse and siduction.

Hmmm, my wife and I have started learning swedish language at VHS (german spoken Volkshochschule), but stopped it because of our professional situation. Perhaps we should find a way to continue with it :-)

Gott nytt år!
  Holger